Tuesday, January 6, 2009

Church of Divine Man vs Spiritual Rights Foundation

Although the Church of Divine Man founded and run by Lewis S Bostwick and now Susan H Bostwick, and William H Duby's Spiritual Rights Foundation are completely separate entities, they have the same teachings and the same perverted spiritual practices deep at their core. But there are significant differences.

These differences are the same differences which distinguish the Naricsssist from the Sociopath. Both are clearly character/personality disorders, they both opperate similarly, but their are some significant differences.

Lewis Bostwick was either Bipolar or Schizophrenic and may have had Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD). He was clearly manic though,

From what I have read in Steve Sanchez's book and from the blogs of Joy Butler and Mike Kawahara, Bill Duby was a true sociopath. His cruelty and manipulations were and are obvious. His behavior was so out of the range of normal, his actions showed complete dissrespect and an enjoyment of inflicting pain on others.

Anyone who calls this man spiritual needs to fully reexamine their own thinking process. This is far from anything I have seen that resembles true spirituality.

At the insitute, the abuse was not as blatant, but it was there nonetheless. The subtle put downs, constant levels of invalidation, the rationalizations, minimalizations, petty whims and rages of both Lewis and Susan were right there in front of everyone. The sarcastic remarks, the direct mysoginistic attitudes and outright putdowns of women in the Mens Fellowship and by Lewis were the norm not the exception.

At the beginings of many of the mens fellowship meetings, we would oftentimes say things like "FUCK WOMEN!" or other derogatory remarks towards the ladies. In one fellowship meeting, Robert Skillman, the director of the Mens Fellowship got up and told us that we were not really there to put down women. That was not the point nor the point of that exercise, it was about moving the energy of our mothers, wives, partners and female friends out of our spaces. Talk about a mixed message.

It was and still is to this day pure mysoginy, or hatred of women.

There were times in the Mens Teachers class where there were humorous annecdotes about the relationships between men and women said by Jon Cotton, but these were not derogatory statements. I liked Jon, and he seemed truly genuine, but was eventually ousted from the church for some lame reason or another.

Both Narcissists and Sociopaths love to abuse, but for different reasons. Narcissists love to abuse to keep their victims because they like to see you squirm. I suspect that the current leaders of the SRF are actually suffering from NPD from what I am reading on Joy and Mikes blog. NPD sufferers and cults actually go hand in hand very well. Narcissists like to keep you in line, get out of line and you are gone. This was common at the institute, challenge Lewis or Susan and you were out! They hated criticisms, Narcissists hate criticisms it pushes their fragile egos in the wrong direction. They will and often do go into rages, but are not necessarily violent or downright cruel. They are cruel and manipulative but in very subtle ways.

Sociopaths or those suffering from ASPD (Antisocial Personality Disorder)abuse because they like inflicting pain. They like those with NPD do keep their abuse somewhat hidden, but if cornered, they will fly into rages and attack with a true vitrol. Something which it sounds like Rev Bill Duby did. Those with ASPD are completely without empathy, remorse or regard for the law, except where they can use it to their advantages. They keep their victims in a constant state of hyperarousal, off balance and dependent upon them. Their rages are often and can be quite violent.

The Church of Divine Man has been audited, watched by the police and investigated somewhat. But there have never been any deep allegations towards thems. Or at least any that I know of. Working in the administrative offices, I saw how they wanted things to look so perfect to the outside world. And they did a good job! Everything was perfect, on the surface. You couldn't quite pin it down, but you knew something was wrong, but nothing overt.

Untill it was too late and you were suckered in and used.

I once read, the greatest weapon one there is out there is the lie. Although I read it in a fantasy book, there is more truth to this than one could realize.

People left CDM for various reaons. But they were still held to the church through the indoctrination process. They never got out on a psychological level.

I did and I am glad I did!

37 comments:

  1. Do narcissists abuse others in blogs? Is truth immune to distortion and fact bending? Is perception an ally or enemy and by what reference or standard?

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  2. My time at the institute under director Chris Murphy was some of the most fulfilling and growthful of my life. However, once I graduated and moved to the church, my experience was dismal. All the people who had been there for 10-20 years seemed pretty unhappy. I worked at the church full time for awhile and found it a pretty dreary place to be. There were definitely people on ego trips. However, I think you find narcissists just about everywhere. In my experience, humans will glom onto any reason they can find to make themselves feel superior to others. Religion is one of the more popular ways people do this. Look at almost any religious leader and you will find someone with Narcissistic Personality Disorder. I agree that narcissists are dangerous and damaging. But I don't think it's worse at CDM (at least during tenure their) than most other religious/spiritual institutions. Organizations by their very nature are self-perpetuating. They crush dissension. They discard anyone who rocks the boat. They attack, condemn and justify in their efforts to aggrandize the org and its leaders. I don't intend to invalidate your experience at CDM. In fact, we were obviously there at very different times. By the time I was there from 1992-1993, Lewis & Susan Bostwick lived in Santa Rosa and had little to do with the church. Susan did seem pretty self-important. But Barry was a very sickly old man, dying from asbestos poisoning. He would give very mellow, thoughtful sermons at church once a month. At one he pointed out that there was a very dysfunctional attitude about love at CDM, as though it was a bad thing. He explained that when he started the church alot of gurus were running around preaching about love and using it as an excuse "to have sex with their followers." Lewis explained that CDM was a place for people to learn to find their own truth, not be told a truth by the church. "I didn't not teach about love because love isn't important. Love is the most powerful force in the universe. If you can't figure out about love, then you have biggers problems than I can help you with." I left CDM shortly after that because it was clear that the people I worked with everyday who ran the church weren't very happy. Even Lewis himself once said that it was a place to help "sick psychics" (which I take to mean sensitive people). He said that it wasn't meant to be a place to hide for the rest of your life. My point is that he called out the crap going on in his own church.I believe you that he was probably on an ego trip. Tons of bosses and spiritual leaders have inappropriate, abusive tirades. It does terrible damage. I'd love to live in a world where people could tolerate differing opinions and raging tantrums were seen as the dangerous, violating assaults of weak individuals that they are. Being a spiritual student leaves you vulnerable to such attacks. The most important lesson I learned from being a spiritual student was to not let others tell me my truth. You should have heard some of the misogynistic, manipulative crap Robert Skillman used to say to me when he was my boss. He was so transparent in his attempts to get inside my head that I would just roll my eyes and laugh at him. As Eleanor Roosevelt once said, no one can make you feel badly about yourself without your permission.

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  3. I did the 2 year clairvoyant program at BPI and it was transformative. I truly healed a great deal. I haven't stayed active in the church since graduating in Jan 2009. And, I will state again, it was a great program. The church leaders encouraged me to have my own truth and own my seniority over my ideas, feelings, truth. That is NOT the teachings of a cult. A cult would not teach independence of thought and will. The church of divine man is not a cult. And to say so is really defamatory not just to the church, but all the thousands of graduates of their programs.

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  4. Hey, if it works for you, it works for you.

    Jeff's main point is: Bill Duby studied from Lewis Bostwick. Bill Duby started the Spiritual Rights Foundation (located walking distance from BPI'S former HQ). While Lewis Bostwick was not exactly Mr. Rogers, Bill Duby was a fucking maniac.

    The teachings you love so much were copied and abused by Bill to achieve a whole new level of control and exploitation - a level he reserved for his most loyal students who remained with the church after their graduation.

    You say since you have graduated in Jan 2009, you have not stayed active. Outfits like BPI and SRF only encourage the top students who have something they want to stick around. Uh, didn't you say you haven't been back?

    So, like Bill Duby (who graduated then pushed out the BPI door not one minute later than necessary) you haven't seen what happens to those who are drawn more closely into that organization.

    Jeff has.

    I understand why you haven't seen what Jeff has as you haven't gone back to BPI since your graduation. I guess they haven't asked you to come back either? BPI did ask Jeff back. They even hired him to work in the BPI office. Were you offered a job?

    Oh, right, you never came back after graduation. My bad.

    Jeff has the absolute right to talk about and comment on his own experience with BPI, which I assure you is much longer and far more in-depth than your two years in the CTP.

    What Jeff says here is not defamation. In fact, he can prove he has more knowledge of the Berkeley Psychic Institute and its inner workings than you will ever have and can speak authoritatively about them based on his many years of experience with them.

    However, I would imagine your two years with BPI qualifies you as an expert. Oh and how often have you been back there since graduation? Sorry, I forgot. My bad again.

    So we have Jeff's truth vs. your, uh, well, whatever it is you are talking about. At any rate, truth prevails.

    I have ample support for my claim that Jeff's blog is not defamatory. It's called the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America. And I proved through the judicial system that beyond ALL doubt what Jeff and I say in our blogs is FREE SPEECH.

    Now put THAT down your grounding cord.

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    1. I couldn't even read this. You sound like the type of person you're trying to denounce.

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    2. Lee-Ann, which post are you referring to? I personally think the one by Mike K Nov 5, 2009 is excellently articulated. People (including you) who share on this blog have anywhere from 7th grade to excellent written verbal abilities (have you re read some you your own??) and Mike is one of the better writers here.

      What if this BPI stuff works best when applied to something else? What if it makes people higher functioning at whatever they are, be it actors, accountants, lawyers, hair stylists, web designers, or lunatics?

      Hey guess what- BPI doesn't (and never has) claim to cure you of your narcissism...
      Maybe that's why the embittered are the most bitter and prone to blame other narcissists for their state.
      They assumed this would be the answer, and they latched on to the very worst aspects, and the best flew far over their head.
      Isn't that what narcissists do, in order to create their "all about me" dramas, and to keep them alive for years???

      Just sayin'

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    3. Lee-Ann, I agree that Mike K's rant is a bit off topic. For one, I haven't seen anyone say that it's defamation, nor do we all need to spend a lot of years in a place to understand its nature.

      I represent sort of both sides. I attended BPI for a year, then went on to "graduate" work and even taught for a time there. I stayed on the periphery while still doing engaging the various programs and education. What I saw was that, exactly contrary to Mike's assertion, people who stayed on for long periods of time and became intrinsic to the organization weren't the talented ones, but the broken ones. I believe that this is why many "insiders" had terrible experiences: I am NOT saying that there weren't many dysfunctional issues at the church and with people there, but those of us who weren't susceptible never got caught up in it. We had, indeed, a fundamentally different experience, and there is a reason why - it's because when we encountered the negative behaviors described, we either challenged them or took some other positive action. My experience was different because my expectations were different.

      There are very clear characteristics of a cult which define it as such, and BPI meets none of them. The very fact that we were all free to come and go, engage what we wanted (or not), dissent, etc make it clear that BPI is not even close to a cult. It helped some people, who took what was useful and went on with life. It didn't help others, who found themselves embroiled in the same psychodrama they were embroiled in before and would find anywhere they went, because it was an underlying, subconscious pattern. Were there crappy people at BPI ready to oblige? You bet. As with at work, on BART, in relationships, etc.

      There were some "teachings" with which I fundamentally disagreed: for example, I never agreed with the implication that LGBT members were just stuck in a past life or trauma. But, I didn't have to accept it to get some use from the techniques taught. I also saw that people who had very poor EQ or were assholes were still assholes, regardless of being in the programs, and worse, they often tried to use psychic-babble as a new weapon: for example, if someone wanted to try to invalidate your point of view, they might say that you had a "picture" you needed to blow or that your energy was out of control.

      But, in short, the words of a classmate held very true: for those of us who came into the organization to learn new tools without forgetting every other valuable tool we'd ever learned, we could only gain. For others, the problems at BPI were just the same set of problems experienced everywhere.

      I'm not sure why Donna flies off into an ad hominem attack on Lee-Ann, inserting between the lines meaning which is not apparently there, but I think that she is making a similar point as I have: only those who were really willing to engage in a process of introspection and movement got that - and would have, in other venues - but those who were disordered to begin with often stayed disordered, just with new vocabulary.

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    4. We all got our own experiences, we do get our kindergarten mock ups, no effort, what did you throw out there?

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  5. Hey, if it works for you, it works for you.

    Jeff's main point is: Bill Duby studied from Lewis Bostwick. Bill Duby started the Spiritual Rights Foundation (located walking distance from BPI'S former HQ). While Lewis Bostwick was not exactly Mr. Rogers, Bill Duby was a fucking maniac.

    The teachings you love so much were copied and abused by Bill to achieve a whole new level of control and exploitation - a level he reserved for his most loyal students who remained with the church after their graduation.

    You say since you have graduated in Jan 2009, you have not stayed active. Outfits like BPI and SRF only encourage the top students who have something they want to stick around. Uh, didn't you say you haven't been back?

    So, like Bill Duby (who graduated then pushed out the BPI door not one minute later than necessary) you haven't seen what happens to those who are drawn more closely into that organization.

    Jeff has.

    I understand why you haven't seen what Jeff has as you haven't gone back to BPI since your graduation. I guess they haven't asked you to come back either? BPI did ask Jeff back. They even hired him to work in the BPI office. Were you offered a job?

    Oh, right, you never came back after graduation. My bad.

    Jeff has the absolute right to talk about and comment on his own experience with BPI, which I assure you is much longer and far more in-depth than your two years in the CTP.

    What Jeff says here is not defamation. In fact, he can prove he has more knowledge of the Berkeley Psychic Institute and its inner workings than you will ever have and can speak authoritatively about them based on his many years of experience with them.

    However, I would imagine your two years with BPI qualifies you as an expert. Oh and how often have you been back there since graduation? Sorry, I forgot. My bad again.

    So we have Jeff's truth vs. your, uh, well, whatever it is you are talking about. At any rate, truth prevails.

    I have ample support for my claim that Jeff's blog is not defamatory. It's called the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America. And I proved through the judicial system that beyond ALL doubt what Jeff and I say in our blogs is FREE SPEECH.

    Now put THAT down your grounding cord.

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  6. I found this page through a Google search, after having interacted with the least pleasant human being I have ever encountered, who is a "reverend" in the Church of Divine Man. I wanted to understand more about this "religion" and have some insight to whether he was typical of its teachings. This man responded to EVERY statement, even the most innocuous, with a sarcastic, cutting remark. Something as simple as "please pass the potatoes" would induce a response such as (direct quote) "thanks for telling me what to do with my life". He is clearly off his rocker, and I guess has the endorsement of his "Church" in being that way. I am going to steer clear of these people as much as I possibly can in the future!

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    1. CDM and BPI don't really espouse a religion, per se. It is mostly technique, with some underlying philosophy that is combined from other religions. CDM regards itself as a Christian church. So, I wouldn't extrapolate too much from your individual experience.

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    2. On of the most unpleasant people I've ever met was a Protestant minister. Yes it happens.

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  7. I've taken classes and programs at BPI/Church of Divine Man. If you ask anybody in my life, the will tell you I am a stronger, more balanced and happier person for it. I would not take back those experience for anything.
    I've always had the liberty to choose my own path there just as much as I do in anyother organization, business or church I've ever been associated with. If a person is expecting anything more than souls having a human experience, you're opperating off of ideals unattached to reality. Also, unfair to all the people that you are projecting your scewed expectations on.

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  8. You are a stronger, happier, more balanced person who has to tell others their ideas are screwed. Okay.

    Excuse me, but I doubt if you could get ONE person to attest to your "improvement." I say this because I have been deluded as you are. I post here because people like to learn what other people think about things--especially expensive things that are sold with claims that reach the heavens, literally.

    I'd like to believe in your transformation, but for half a century I've been personally involved with people who claimed to have abilities and qualities from spiritual experiences they paid a lot for, and I'm sorry to say NOT ONE of them was a truly humble, kind, decent or helpful person. They all made it a practice to impose their wills on others and to take disagreement as an act of war.

    I may have projected idealistic expectations on to new age gurus, but I'm trying now to stand on the ground and look around like a free person. That's all I wish for anyone else.

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    1. But, you are projecting right now, by assuming that everyone is deluded, only because you considered yourself deluded. The writer didn't claim to have amazing powers, just to be happier and stronger.

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    2. Everyone has abilities If you don't see your own I feel sorry for you. The true teachings from Lewis were to teach one to believe in themselves. Siting alongside trained physics and one on one readings (me reading)taught me my inner voice was real. I'd "see" something and someone else would say it or I'd see something and the readee would have genuine shock on me knowing the unsaid. I stopped going to church soon after Lewis passed. I don't go around reading people, I do if they ask, for free. I just trust myself.

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  9. To the poster who covertly accuses Jeff of being a narcissist for having this blog, here is an answer.

    Jeff won't stand by while people who are either charlatans or are deeply deluded about their own powers and efficacy sell invisible benefits to a new generation of vulnerable seekers. How is that narcissistic? It seems to me like the act of a healthy, social personality.

    Religion, many new agers can agree, is often a scam to elevate narcissists to positions of power where they can "pontificate" for a living and live off the labor of those who actually contribute tangible goods and services to society. These new agers might laugh at televangelists who charge $10 for a "prayer cloth." Those scammers, ha, ha!

    But, WHAT are YOU pedaling? I assume you're in the "biz," or Jeff's blog wouldn't bother you so much.

    You're NOT narcissists? No?

    You're not living like little tin-kings and queens off the gullibility of people who buy your services and then can't do a thing with them, OR, follow in your footsteps by selling them to new suckers?

    Isn't that a 'spiritual' pyramid scheme? Everybody in the psychic pipeline pretends to have psychic powers the way Evangelicals pretend to speak in tongues. How is it any different? Aren't people just scared and ashamed to say they didn't get anything for their money???

    James Van Pragh and John Edwards are con-artists. Period. So are you, you just either believe your own b.s. or you haven't been exposed yet. ALL psychic mediums work the same way and it is easily explicated. I WISH you could prove your nonsense is real, but you can't and you know it. So you pretend to have pity and disapproval for people who challenge you. That's your privilege, but it isn't a position of integrity, is it?

    Explain to me how the above is not valid. Is it an attack? Or is it just the unvarnished truth?

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    1. LOL You must feel you got suckered in at some point. It just sounds angry.....i have no real opinion but this just sounds like a tantrum. I suggest you pull up you're socks,glide into neutral and rewrite this so it can be deciphered as possibly valid.

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    2. Lee-Ann,

      How is this posting not readable? Please let us know. I see coherent writing and a steady stream of thought?

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    3. Well Jeff, when Lee-Ann is so busy trolling and throwing hand grenades, she doesn't have time to notice things along the way...

      or read either.

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    4. Hi Mike,

      Nope she doesn't have much time to notice things along the way. Not much of a reader at all!

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    5. It seems to me that you guys are having trouble reading - you've missed her point, entirely. She didn't say the post was unreadable. She said that it needed to be re-written to be valid (from her point of view). I am amazed at how much projection and inferred meaning is rampant in this thread.

      It's clear that the above poster is a "skeptic". It's less clear that s/he has a solid knowledge base of ongoing studies in consciousness - peer reviewed, double blind, highly compelling studies. Hell, even Einstein acknowledged the existence of non-locality, or spookiness at a distance. The world is not as black and white as is comfortable for many; but comfort often has no relation to truth.

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    6. Lee-Ann March 19, 2012 at 12:15 AM:
      I couldn't even read this.


      If that is the comment you are talking about, you're about half right - at best.

      You may be right about her saying she wanted comments and posts to reflect her own perspective. However, she completely missed the point - as you and others have as well.

      I defended PsychDoctorate from an attack on his motives and character. That is it.

      How you can infer so much about someone when seeing so little about that person - well, I guess you must be really good at psychic readings.

      But as you've missed an obvious point, that's the only reading you're good at.

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    7. Lewis said it will be a great day when scientists prove there is Spirit. Quantum Physics is the way, infinite possibilities.

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    8. Anonymous

      As of this day, there has been no scientific validtation that the soul/spirit exists. Also unless you are a physicist or have a degree is quantum physics, you are in no place to dicuss it.

      Those who think they know something about quantum physics know absolutely nothing about it whatsoever.

      I know psychology, I do not know quantum physics.

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  10. Funny, my ex guru was shocked that I was still alive 2 months after I denounced the teachings in her face, she really thought she was strong enough to create my demise.... shows how strong her powers were. I knew I was on the wrong track after spending hundreds of hours and conversations with her about the topic of my father, she one nite jumped out of her skin and said "your father is dead right?" Mwahhhhhahhhah, that was my que,,get the F out... as I had discussed all my on going problems with her about him.. Operative word (ongoing) Stupid shit I believed in................derrrrrrrr.. they are all fake and use very logical ways to manipulate your responses.. Nice post by the by and great new blog Jeffery!!

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  11. HAHAHA.. Anonymous calls his/her self a graduate of BPI ... funny..... people graduate from accredited schools..... that is like admitting you went to the University of Bozo and have clown certificate and can practice in Kazakhstan too, (like that makes you worldly)?...? Not sure I would let everyone know your credentials.. rethink.....

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    1. Why are you laughing so sarcastically? You are the one who's anonymous. I can't believe how much rudeness I here on this blog. Peace out y'all.

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  12. WHAT HAPPENED TO LOVE??? I WISH PEOPLE WOULD JUST GET ALONG AT ALL LEVELS, INCLUDING THIS ONE!

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  13. Love takes work, and it requires two to tango! Deciet, usury, manipulation, lies and deluded thought are not love, they never have.

    Getting along with one another also takes a lot of work. It requires honesty, tact and diplomacy. Something which I rarely saw at the institute. Nope it was my way or the highway. That was Lewises and Susans way of thinking. There was no discourse, there was no middle ground, there was not acceptance as they so liked to preach.

    That is one of the reasons I write in this blog, so that others can learn to see through the lies and break free from the bonds of delusions and magical thinking these places expounge!

    Jeffrey

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  14. i am reportng BPI to IRS for abusing non profit status. Haven't they been investigated for this yet? It used to be that paying money to a "church" was called a "donation". On a recent visit to them for a reading (I know I shouldn't have gone but it'd been years and sometimes it's fun). I didn't have any money and told them it's supposed to be donation anyway but they said "Things have changed and now you HAVE to pay". Being dumb I paid by credit card (which luckily later my bank removed the charge). The receipt said "no services were received", as they try to hide behind their non profit status. And my bank statement categorized the charge as a "legal service". When I asked the bpi head person about the above discrepancies she never responded. they are such asses. they always say "get people out of your space" but all they do is get in your space. or they always say to validate yourself or take care of yourself and all they do is treat people badly.

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  15. Report BPI's abuse of their non profit status by sending form 3949A to IRS. Instructions at http://www.irs.gov/individuals/article/0,,id=106778,00.html

    What is CDM's main address: 1288 9th Street
    Berkeley, CA 94710? Of course they go by different names all the time to avoid penalties.
    Look at their current posting regarding their changes at http://www.berkeleypsychic.com/ShowPage.asp?id=163.
    On same page click their "Fill out our Graduate Idea Submission Form so we can hear from you!" to send them feedback
    athttps://web40plus.wufoo.com/forms/bpi-graduate-idea-submission/

    i just told them the best thing for them to do is close, quit being liars, quit glorifying money, get mental help. like it will do any good.

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  16. After studying at BPI for 20 wonderful years as a 6 week student, Women's Teacher, Minister and Staff member in Santa Rosa and one-to-one graduate. I found many absolute jerks and stuck souls. I found levels of control that I did not put up with. But BPI is not about the individual personalities involved. And every one of us is nuts in some way or another. It's just much more noticeable if your grounded and in the center of you head. I knew that the control levels were there so I never worked for the church, took only the programs that interested me. Dropped out of the ones that didn't. I found that the important thing about BPI is the tools and the amazing healing that is created. I created long lasting relationship with people that I bonded with as I worked with them through their most intimate and painful periods. I am blown away every time I clairvoyantly read someone and each reading is such an amazing miracle. I can complain to high heaven about the control energy and the jerks, but that takes away from the very real tools, that create change in one's deepest soul. I teach now on my own and teach with caring and compassion and from love. And though BPI did not give me the teaching from love persepective it gave me everything else that made me the happy and healthy psychic I am today. Thank you BPI, thank you Lewis Bostwick and thank you funny people are are equally as stuck as the BPI graduate that they are complaining about, for once again making me laugh. As Lewis used to say: Run your energy, dammit! In Affinity and Joy. In forgiveness and healing. In the light of love.

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    1. Hello Anonymous,

      YOu say you are a psychic? Have your abilities been empirically validated and what is your accuracy rating based on neutral third parties and strict controlled observation? You say you are a teacher? What are you qualifications?

      by the way, your last statement is really nothing more than an empty plattitude.

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    2. Her credentials are that she was trained in a method and is certified by that organization to teach that method. As with any organization with proffers education. In fact, the Women's Teaching Program is a 3-year program, which means that it requires more time in training than a certificate to teach high school. This is no different than someone taking project management training which then qualifies them to teach, or hypnotherapy, EMDR, etc training. No one is saying that BPI was an accredited university, but nor does it allow just anyone to teach its methods. Think what you will about those methods, but they are nevertheless part of a comprehensive approach.

      I don't think PD is a narcissist, based on what I know, but it is clear that he's a materialist - and one whose belief in materialism and bad experience seems to be occluding an ability to impartially review the evidence. The current evidence is, at worst, equivocal, and therefore not conclusive that perceptions lumped together as "psychic" don't exist. Science is supposed to be open until something is firmly proven wrong....you have no such proof. At best, you can say, "I don't know", not "No".

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    3. Some people don't believe in therapy or AA either.

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    4. Just because you don't believe in something doesn't mean it doesn't work. And I refer to those realms which have scientific validity. Those who say they don't believe in these things show that they are ignorant or stupid and uneducated for the most part.

      There is no known empirically based scientific evidence to support the existence of psychism or psychics whatsoever. To believe is one thing, to say with certainty that it exists shows a degree self delusion and ignorance.

      Your analogy is weak at best.

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